what baits have been best

Why bother with complex rigs? I think many of you would be amazed at the rigs Trefor West uses. I too use the same rig. Its simply a running ledger with a gravel guard over the hook swivel. You couldnt ask for an easier rig. If Trev can catch hundreds of Barbel on this rig a year, then I'm as sure as hell gonna be using that too.

Originally Posted by Pfloyd

Hi have been trying this rig with some resonable success and thought I'd post a diagram and see what you guys thought. all Comment welcomed Regards Paul

Paul,

Do you find this rig more prone to tangles that standard running ledger or less so?

Ta

Kurt

Oh dear, this is probably cat among the pigeons time!!

I don’t like the rig at all, I shall start at the top as to why!

Braid main line – no, No, NO and NO, I have spent too much time in my dry suit in the river removing this stuff from snags and features, it never seems to rot and it is therefore always dangerous, to be fair nylon takes a while to degrade particularly in the stronger strains but it will eventually fall apart and therefore is less of a danger to aquatic life.
I don’t do much ledgering for Barbel these days, my fishing is nearly all on the float with line diameter that is thinner than the accepted norm but if I do go on the tip I almost never use anything more than 12lb.

Your lead has no breakaway provision, I always use a breakaway clip, these mainly snap at about 4lb, this means that when a lead catches between rocks or any other snag all I do is leave a lead and not yards and yards of main line.
This means I always use a running lead rig, my catches have never suffered because of this, bolt rigs or semi fixed rigs (which I do not really approve of) were developed for Carp fishing where the angler is often asleep and needs an alarm (which I defiantly disapprove of, for Barbel fishing) and thus needs the fish to hook it’s self ( not fishing at all, in my opinion, more like trapping, but that is for another place).
So a running rig with a breakaway clip (the Enterprise one is very good, with a very large ring ), a small rubber bead to protect the knot, which is tied to a diamond eye size 10 swivel.
The hook length I use IS often braid and that depends upon what bait I intend to use, but it is ALWAYS of a lower breaking strain than the main line so that if I hook up on a snag I do not leave yards and yards of main line all over the river bed, Fanny Deadbrass and co may well think a heavier hook line to main line ratio is OK, simply put they are wrong, fish safety and care of all aquatic creatures is far more important than the silly games they play!

Hook and presentation is totally dependant on the bait and how I expect the fish to pick up the bait, I must admit I very often do not use a hair rig, but then again I do not very often use Boilies or Pellets and if I do I rarely hair rig them.
The hair rig and its use I will not go into, but to understand why it is used you need to understand how and why fish picks up a bait in the way they do, Barbel are not Carp they live, feed and take a bait in a very different way to Carp, their mouths are very different and their reaction to baits are also very different, studying that will probably provide many of the answers you seek.

If it seems I am having a go, then I apologise, that is certainly NOT the intention, but I don’t like to see anglers making obvious mistakes AND you did ask for opinion, usually I don’t give advice unless asked and I do see so very many anglers making obvious mistakes almost every time I go fishing, but then again as long as they are happy.

One last thing, if you do what everyone else is doing, you are only ever likely to catch what everyone else is catching, do not end up as a “one trick pony” Barbel are relatively easy to catch, but they are not entirely stupid, they operate on instinct, use their instinct against them, study their habits and (I will use this horrible American saying) “Start to think outside the box”

Tight Lines mate.

hi Zanderman

Thanks for your comments they very much appreciated.

If you have read the thread fully then you will have read my reasoning behind trying this rig so I wont repeat myself again. As for braid or mono mainline we all have our own prferences and there is a thread on here where we can debate the pros and cons of each. The lead used in the the rig does in fact have a breakaway feature, it has a slit down one side of the lead so that if pulled between rocks etc it will slide up the insert and fall off leaving only the lead and not the whole rig in the river.

I would like to know how you attach a 14mm pellet to the hook without the use of a hair rig though.

Regards

Paul

Originally Posted by Pfloyd

I would like to know how you attach a 14mm pellet to the hook without the use of a hair rig though. Regards Paul

A bait band or if you want to complicate things unnecessarily, super glue.

Or don't use pellets at all, there are many baits that are not considered or have grown out of favour.

Try something different, to be honest I have probably caught more Barbel on Elderberry than I have on Pellets, my most successful bait by far has been Maggots they never seem to go out of favour or out of season, Casters are a viable alternative, as is Hemp, Lobworms, Cheese (hard as a paste or even Diary lea in very cold water), Luncheon meat, Sausage meat, Belly of Pork, Streaky Bacon, Tares, Corn, Maize, Minced meat, Steak strips, and Bread, I have had more Barbel on these than I have on Pellets, but I have also caught on Minnows, Sardine chunks, Slugs, Rose Hips, Potatoes (pre boiled tinned), Red Kidney beans, Baked beans, Cherry tomatoes and Pasta.

Fact is the range of bait a Barbel will take is endless, I do admit I did catch a 14lb Barbel on a 10mm pellet but I have taken many more and bigger on various of the baits I mentioned, simply because I wanted to do something different.

I remember taking two fish one was 15lb 3oz and the other was 16lb 10oz on Luncheon meat from the river Kennet.
Everyone knew meat was blown as a bait and in normal conditions I would probably agree but in flood water with massive logs and dead dinosaurs floating down a large lump of un-flavoured Old Oak Luncheon meat cut up four chunks from a large tin, mounted without a hair on a size 2 hook accounted for both these fish.

What I am saying is dare to be different, the super stars in the mags may like to sell product but you don’t have to buy it, I don’t not because I am tight (I bloody am though) but because when I go fishing seriously for Barbel I am looking to catch fish that are substantially bigger than average, these fish tend to be a little more wary so continuing to do the same as everyone else will only produce the same fish as everyone else.

Ok there is always a chance of getting lucky, but as I have never been lucky in my life I prefer to consider all the options, study the problem and then formulate a solution.
Then watch the weather and river conditions with care and put the right bait in the right spot at the right time.

Fishing can be quite simple, all you need to do is ask a reasonable question at a reasonable time and you will get a reasonable answer.

Bit like most things in life.

Tight Lines.

Zanderman

I really don't see what your getting at as I would like to think that the rig I came up with is thinking "out of the box" as you call it when it comes to barbel fishing and before you say it no i didn't just copy a carp rig. I gave it some long hard thought to every part of the rig and thats what I ended up with. As for bait I think i've used just as many different baits as yourself, and the assertion i just use pellets is insulting. How many barbel have you had on popup flavoured corn thats if you've even considered it as a barbel bait. I spend a lot of time thinking about my barbel angling and would prefer you kept your comments about mine to yourself as you don't even know me and how I go about my fishing.

Regards

Paul

Pfloyd

That was a comment to the Pellet answer from the previous post, it was a general reply and not a swipe at you in any way, if I were replying to you I would address you as I have in this post, as for assertion that you used "just used pellet", sadly you mis-read the intention, you may not use pellet much at all but others do, thus my comments were “general” and not “targeted”!
Several of my more local fisheries ARE fished with pellets and often heavily pre-baited, not a problem in the warmer months but a nightmare in winter when Barbel often only feed once every couple of days and the introduction of large amounts of pellet can make life difficult for everyone!


Pop up flavoured Corn, you are right I cannot remember ever using that, in the main I use no flavours at all, I tend to use “washed out” baits rather more than flavoured baits as I tend to fish waters that are local to Hertfordshire and are thus usually heavily fished, “washed out” bait seems to have a slight edge.

As for:-

“I spend a lot of time thinking about my barbel angling and would prefer you kept your comments about mine to yourself as you don't even know me and how I go about my fishing.”


As I said previously, my comments were of a general nature, they were not aimed at you in any way, nor were they intended to be derogatory, I will however take your very good advice and keep my own council in future.


I am sure you rig will bring you lots of success.

Tight lines